This is disappointing. Ryan, who was an intern at SGM’s St Pete church, posted his story last week.
I wanted to feature his story as a post, but as he’s using his name, and naming names, I needed to do some work behind the scenes. I asked for an email from his wife to hear her view, and asked Ryan to provide 2 or 3 witnesses. I’ve heard from 3 people so far, including one who gave me a pretty detailed account of the “family meeting” that Ryan referenced. All who I’ve been in contact with have confirmed his story.
I then sent an email over the weekend to the sr p of St Pete, and to his secretary, just in case he was out of town. I asked him if he wanted to respond, and gave him my personal email and phone number. Here it is:
Hi Jerry,
My name is Jim Xxxxxxxxx. I was a CGL at the Titusville church.
I run sgmrefuge.com
A former member of Gulf Coast has posted to our blog.
Since he’s being very specific, I wanted to give you a chance to respond.
You can call me any time @ XXX-504-4542, or bounce back a note if you like.
I asked him for “2 or 3 witnesses”, and I’ve received 3 emails so far, and I’m told that more are coming.
I’d really like to hear your side of the story.
Grace,
Jim
No Response. Here’s what’s sad-even after everything you’re about to read, Ryan is still ready to meet with Jerry and reconcile. Jerry apparently can’t be bothered with such trivial matters.
Here’s Ryan’s post:
My name is Ryan XxXxxxxxxx (edited by Jim), I’m 22, and I was an intern at the SGM church in St. Petersburg, Florida. When I posted at SGM survivors about 6 months ago, I used the name “exintern” because I hoped that a little anonymity would help protect me in my efforts to salvage some of my friendships at the church. The lies my old senior pastor spread about me have pretty much ended most of those friendships, so I don’t have anything to gain anymore by not disclosing my name. So, here I am, I’m not concerned with who knows I’m on here anymore, though I’ll probably keep posting under “exintern” for the sake of continuity.
I came to SGM in 2002 as a senior in high school. I made some friends, settled in despite some misgivings about the church’s lack of missions/evangelism (I’ve wanted to be a missionary since I was about 11), and became a member. I’m a bit of a theology/philosophy nerd, so I got noticed by the leadership fairly quickly. I moved up the ranks and became fully committed to the cause. This all culminated with me being made a pastoral intern in 2006.
I agreed to one year of part-time interning. After 6 months, though, I knew I was done. I was seeing behind closed doors now, and I saw an awful lot I didn’t like. I saw manipulation and controlling of church members. I saw a CEO-like leadership style from the senior pastor, with his supposed “plurality of elders” really nothing more than yes-men. I saw tens of thousands of dollars being spent on silly things like Celebration conferences while missions mostly got neglected. I saw major decisions being made with zero transparency to the church body. I wasn’t ok with any of it, so I started looking for a way out.
In January of 2007, I was engaged to my lovely wife Fallon (who had started working for a pro-life organization). I told the senior pastor that I wasn’t making enough money to support a wife (which was true, they never ended up paying me despite the pastor’s promise to “do what they could”. Thank the Lord I still had my college Starbucks job). I went out and got a job teaching math at a local public school, and quietly started looking/praying for another church.
To be honest, I wavered. I went back and forth about whether to leave or just “stick it out” until our planned move this year. The assistant pastor asked me point-blank once whether I was considering leaving, to which I responded “no” because at that point I wanted to stick it out. I was going through some major “fear of man”, as they would say, and though I expressed many of my disagreements, I never did tell them that I was considering leaving. I was simply too afraid of what they might do or say. Looking back, I realize how sick of a situation it actually was. No one should be afraid of their pastors. No one.
Fallon and I were married in June. Some family issues that the pastors grossly mishandled over the summer caused me to go back to the church-searching process. I was no longer able to talk myself into being a part of what was going on. In October we found a wonderful church and made the switch. I wrote a very complimentary email to the pastors, both thanking them for all that they had done for me, and explaining again, in as un-insulting terms as I could muster, what my disagreements were. The two main issues I mentioned were a lack of missions and evangelism, and my problems with the church polity structure. I thought this was the end.
Our senior pastor emailed me back and asked if Fallon and I would meet with him & his wife, to which we agreed. Big mistake. They met us in a public place, and the assistant pastor came as well. The senior pastor yelled and screamed at us for about an hour, and called me insulting names like “insane”. Fallon was in tears, and we were both embarrassed by the public setting. We left, again thinking this was the end.
A few weeks later, I found out that a church meeting had been called about us. During this meeting, the senior pastor had decided to spread lies about me from the pulpit. He told the congregation that my reasons for leaving were fabricated and bogus, that I had lied to Fallon about my reasons for leaving and manipulated her, that she wanted nothing to do with our leaving, and that they should pray for her. I found out all of this from old friends coming to confront me, including my own brother-in-law, who called me an “emotionally-abusive husband” to my face. I quickly found that I had very few friends anymore.
Fallon called many of the ladies in the church to assure them that I had not abused her in any way, that she was very happy in our marriage, and that she had agreed with all of my reasons for leaving and that she was pleased with our new church. Rather than call me and apologize, people in the church just started shunning her too.
I have not confronted the pastor about all of this, though I think I probably should at some point. After his brutality to us at the last meeting, I’m simply not ready to talk to him again. We’re not at that point in our healing process yet.
So here we are. We have been very blessed by our new church, where the pastor has ministered to us greatly. I haven’t forgotten my desire to be a missionary. On August 14th we’re moving to Boston so that I can attend law school: my goal is to be an attorney/missionary with International Justice Mission and fight against slavery and sex trafficking in Africa or Asia. My beautiful wife continues in her calling to fight in the pro-life cause, working with crisis pregnancy centers here now and hopefully in Boston soon, and who knows where in the future.
July 30th, 2008 at 1:12 pm
Wow!… another chance for biblical reconciliation to take place with an SGM pastor… and another chance blown off by an SGM pastor.
Hmmmmm…. “caught” or “taught”….
July 30th, 2008 at 1:19 pm
Thanks for your story Ryan. Keep up the good fight. God Bless you with your noble calling.
July 30th, 2008 at 2:34 pm
As Ryan’s mom, I find myself weeping all over again, reading what he and my DIl have gone through. Even though I am more than aware of what transpired, somehow seeing it in print is painful. That the sr p and his staff have not responded is of no surprise to me. Any attempts of calm, intelligent dialogue w/the sr p and/or the assoc. p were either blown off or exercises in futility, when we were all going through so much.
Ryan and Fallon, Dad and I love you both so much and we are so proud of you. We are behind you 100% and applaud you for how you have handled yourselves through out …and for taking a stand for what is true and right.
Jim and Carole, thank you for the venue for them to do just that, publically. I think the Kingdom of Jones and SGM have only just begun to fall……..how very sad to discover what a house of cards it all really is.
July 30th, 2008 at 2:42 pm
Patty,
Its nice to meet you and I’m sure your DS and DIL will benefit from your tender heart. Welcome to this little board.
July 30th, 2008 at 2:56 pm
Patty!!! and Ryan and Fallon!!!
Our hearts and our prayers are with you all… it’s very difficult to “re-live” those experiences. But, at the same time, these authoritarian abuses of leadership within SGM has to be revealed and illuminated. Truth is the only way these things will ever change… or be stopped. In sharing your experience, it will help open eyes and promote the healing of hearts and spiritual lives of many who have had to endure these same types of abuse at the hands of SGM and their family of churches. For that, I am so thankful and grateful to you! I know how hard it is to share what truly happened “behind the scenes.”
Here’s the good news… we are free of SGM and it’s abusive lifestyle. We are free to walk in God’s Truth, and live our lives for His glory… we don’t have to live our lives to please any man and his expectations. That is certainly not what God wants for any of us! He is our all in all… not SGM pastors and leadership… to place ANY mere man in the place of God is idolatry. Wrong by any stretch of the imagination or squinting of eyes.
:sigh: (’nuff said…)
July 30th, 2008 at 3:22 pm
They have a consistent policy of not discussing the problems in their church. They have demonstrated this quite clearly for the last year.
July 30th, 2008 at 3:27 pm
How many times have we heard someone say their “Pastor” yelled at them (sometimes in public)? Enough to be very distraught that any man in leadership thinks he has the right to be so rude and mean to any member in his church! What’s that all about?
July 30th, 2008 at 3:31 pm
Jim, I’m so humbled and encouraged by your following of Biblical principles and giving the other pastor the chance to respond to detailed accusations. I don’t know why I am also a bit surprised, you did the same with your own pastor, Tim. But I guess I didn’t expect this blog to become a sort of cyber-reconciliation spot! But I see the plans the Lord has extends (as usual) beyond our own expectations and hope.
I will now be praying that perhaps your role in assisting those who can reconcile to do just that will be made possible through this site. I have to confess I don’t think much about reconciliation with my SGM pastors or anyone else there - to be honest, most days I just think about my own spiritual survival..I guess this just goes to show that this website is more than a refuge, it can be a place of reconciliation as well. maybe even for me one day, Lord willing.
thank you for providing such a place to us.
July 30th, 2008 at 3:49 pm
Concerned,
So much goes on behind the scenes here. When Ryan composed his post, he stated that he wasn’t sure if he was ready to speak with his ex p. When I brought the topic up, he was for it. He really is an exceptional young man. Gulf Coast is not better off without him.
Too bad the ex p isn’t interested in communicating.
Thanks for your kind words and your prayers!
I’d give your own situation time.
July 30th, 2008 at 3:57 pm
Patty,
I hope that you weren’t caught off guard. Ryan and I worked out a time frame when I asked if I could make his comment a main post.
We had a long conversation on the phone, and have exchanged many emails. I’m very impressed with him-you have every reason to be proud!
July 30th, 2008 at 4:02 pm
DB, I thanked you for your welcome over on another ‘topic’….I read and then forget that there are different topics ! LOL…anyway, thanks again.
Jim, not at all; Ryan ran it past me, and I knew that this was coming….for whatever reason reading it in print today just hit me all over again…..
I am indeed very proud…thank you!!!
July 30th, 2008 at 4:37 pm
Jim, Carole, Anonymous, Mom, and everyone else,
Thank you so much for your many knind words. They mean a great deal to me and our so very encouraging for Fallon and I.
The Lord gave me a change of heart this afternoon…for the first time, I’m abe to say that I honestly am grateful that I went through all of this. Why? God has taught me an invaluable lesson through all of this, one that I pray will stick with me: my allegiance isn’t to a particular church, a denomination, or reformed theology. My allegiance is to Jesus Christ. The “dearest place on earth” isn’t a church auditorium, filled with the saints though it may be. The dearest place on earth is in the throne room of God, where we can go in prayer, because the seperating veil has been torn by the blood of Our Lord. May I never make a church an idol again!
Let’s keep those in prayer who are still in the “Kingdom of the Blind”. There are many young interns, like I was, who either haven’t opened their eyes, or whose mouths have been shut by fear. As we pray, we can trust that God has the best interest all of our friends in SGM in mind. God is in control, as some old Christian singer my Mom listens to likes to belt out :)
July 30th, 2008 at 4:42 pm
Ryan,
Well said.
Except-Twila is my age.
That would make her young, like me.
July 30th, 2008 at 5:16 pm
Hahahahahahhahahahahahahaha!!!!
Jim… What Ryan just said to you re: Twila is the equivalent of me getting “ma’amed!”
Hahahah! (btw… Jim is MUCH older than I am! MUCH!!)
July 30th, 2008 at 5:22 pm
Sort of the opposite of me getting carded, huh?
July 30th, 2008 at 5:25 pm
DB… yep!
July 30th, 2008 at 5:35 pm
Carole, thank you and amen, to your post #5.
CDhost…you are right, they have a consistent policy in not discussing problems in their church…because from their perspective there is no problem—it’s simply their way or the highway, no discussion necessary.
Canary, yes, distraught is a good word…..a ‘pastor’ yelling and screaming at one of his sheep. Hmmm…professional, godly, pastoral communication….NOT.
Concerned, I agree, it is really terrific the way that this has become a place of offering reconciliation. Unfortunately, I don’t think it will happen unless an incredible revival happens among the SGM leadership. Not impossible for God, of course….but short of that, I don’t think it will happen. I will pray for your spiritual revival…for your healing….my heart goes out to you.
Ok, crying again, this time so moved by my son….all I can say is Amen, and Amen and …..watch who you’re calling old!
July 30th, 2008 at 7:15 pm
Ryan said,
“My allegiance is to Jesus Christ. The ‘dearest place on earth’ isn’t a church auditorium, filled with the saints though it may be. The dearest place on earth is in the throne room of God, where we can go in prayer, because the seperating veil has been torn by the blood of Our Lord.”
For this very reason, to learn this very lesson that can NEVER be taken away from me, now I too am grateful for my PDI experience (and others like it). I have pounded this Truth into my children, so hopefully they will never have to go through what we all have experienced. Thank you again for your courage to tell your story and your heart that hopes for reconciliation.
Patty,
It is painful to relive these stories. How much more so when it is not only you, but your son and daughter-in-law as well. Blessings to you! BTW, that old lady Twila is one of my personal favorites. The other day my daughter said that if it wasn’t for Twila and C.S. Lewis, she’s not sure if she’d still be saved! (She was joking, but that was her way of expressing how much those two have impacted her life.)
Jim and Carole,
We continue to hope and pray with you for some spark from SGM toward reconciliation. I agree with Concerned, it is very moving to see how serious you are in reaching not only the wounded, but SGM leadership as well. You truly are peacemakers.
July 30th, 2008 at 10:06 pm
Thanks Gracie!
July 30th, 2008 at 11:43 pm
Gracie, you are so right…hurt me, ok, hurt my kids…that’s another story.
Yep, many a time that old gal Twila has reminded me that “God is in control” !!! :-D
July 31st, 2008 at 12:08 am
http://www.christianmusiclight.....ecover.jpg
Ahem….does this look like an OLD lady?
July 31st, 2008 at 12:17 am
Ellie, I knew you would have something to say about Twila!! LOL!
July 31st, 2008 at 12:28 am
OK, according to wikipedia, Ms. Paris began her illustrious career in 1981…a full four years before I was born. She is also about six months older than my “phenomenal” mom (to use an Eric Simmons word…heh, sorry, I just read John’s latest at spiritual tyranny and I’m still chuckling to myself)
In my book, that gets the “o” word applied to you every time
July 31st, 2008 at 7:24 am
She would fall into the, “well preserved” category.
July 31st, 2008 at 7:46 am
LOL….she is indeed well preserved…much more so than me!
July 31st, 2008 at 1:17 pm
Hey Patty - do something about that whippersnapper.
Gracie, NObody picks on Twila when I’m around and doesn’t get called on it, lolol!
Quoting from an anonymous poster on another blog found in googleland:
“Old” and “age” are two different things. The two are completely separate.
As admitted, I have ‘old’ days. As ***** points out in many posts, he meets alot of Young People in their later years.
I have NEVER been ashamed to say my age in years. But, I am sometimes sadden to see folks my age start to give up on life and finally reach a state of giving up the thrill of living. That is my definition of Old. It cannot be measured in Years. It is found in the mind. Some of the ‘Oldest’ people I have ever seen have reached it at quite an early age.
July 31st, 2008 at 3:00 pm
To add to the wisdom above me, age is relatively relative.
40 is the new 30, etc. is true. Think about your own grandparents (go dig up some photos,) and at least mine look old, really *old* when they were my age. My mom looks better than my grandparents and I, to run the risk of vanity, look better than she did at my age.
In a large sense, we get to live two lifetimes. I, personally, want to make the best of that fact.
July 31st, 2008 at 3:03 pm
Since we are talking about OLD? Can somebody tell me when one gets inducted to the Enlightened Geriatric Club… The one where you’re right, just because you’re old? I asked robin boysvert some years ago that question… and he still hasn’t answered me.
I feel so lost!!!
July 31st, 2008 at 3:07 pm
Hehe…guess I’ll never get old…cause I am very rarely right.
July 31st, 2008 at 3:26 pm
RE #12:
“my allegiance isn’t to a particular church, a denomination, or reformed theology. My allegiance is to Jesus Christ. The “dearest place on earth” isn’t a church auditorium, filled with the saints though it may be. The dearest place on earth is in the throne room of God, where we can go in prayer, because the separating veil has been torn by the blood of Our Lord. May I never make a church an idol again!”
Precious wisdom.
July 31st, 2008 at 3:40 pm
The trick is to never actually grow up in the first place.
July 31st, 2008 at 3:59 pm
I don’t wanna grow up, I’m a Toys R’ Us kid.
A million toys to choose from, that I can play with.
From bikes to trikes and video games,
its the biggest toy stor there is. GEE WIZ!
I don’t wanna grow up, cuz baby if I did….
I wouldn’t be a toys r’ us kid!
July 31st, 2008 at 10:24 pm
Sorry folks, I just can’t let you go around redefining words to make yourselves feel better. We all left that, remember?
OLD: (used especially of persons) having lived for a relatively long time or attained a specific age
Ellie, sounds like “old” and “age” aren’t two different things after all. Perhaps you’re thinking of “feeble” instead?
Twila is getting old (especially if “relatively long time” is relative to the other active CCM recording artists), but I’ll grant you she’s certainly not feeble!
July 31st, 2008 at 10:37 pm
I keep trying to reign in my whippersnapper! :-) But he says he’s an adult now, all grown up and married and everything! sheesh!
Travis, touche! Yes, we all did just leave the environment of redefining words to make ourselves feel better :-D
July 31st, 2008 at 10:41 pm
Hmmmmmm… I think it’s rather “funny” that all you young pups are coming on here “defining” old for those that may be… wellllll… just a tad, a smidge, bit older than you guys are…
(Young whippersnappers…. think they know stuff!)
July 31st, 2008 at 10:57 pm
Meanwhile I find it funny that all you… seasoned veterans (*ahem*) fight so strongly against a term which, Biblically, connotes respect and dignity.
(Methinks she doth protest too much, exintern…)
If I were of more the Mahaney persuasion, I might point out that it is a sign of humility to accept even those labels which we find unflattering, if they are objectively true. But since I’m not, I wouldn’t dream of implying any such thing!
I’ll simply wear the “whippersnapper” badge with honor. I’ve now come to a station in life where I’m not the youngest professional in my office, so it helps keep a certain balance in my life.
And “old” was defined in my comment above by Princeton WordNet. I think the folks over there are maybe not all quite so young as myself… but I do not know for sure.
(In all seriousness? To my mind, generally young = foolish, old = wise, and wisdom > youthfulness. I’d take Twila’s music over Jump5’s any day! I’d also take the counsel of a 65-year-old layman sage over that of a 22-year-old associate pastor for the same reason. So while I may apply a certain three letter word to more people here than others might, it is not done as an insult. I’ve been spending my whole life trying to act like a wise old man. Hopefully I’ll get there one day.)
July 31st, 2008 at 11:08 pm
While us old guys spend our whole day trying to stay awake.
I hate it when I wake up in my recliner with drool in my chin.
July 31st, 2008 at 11:09 pm
Although the early bird special was wonderful today.
July 31st, 2008 at 11:11 pm
(did Travis reference Jump5?)
July 31st, 2008 at 11:16 pm
Ahhhh… but, Travis… YOU have defined the word “old” to fit your own opinion!
What does “relatively long time” and “specific age” mean? Methinks it is all relative… depending on whether you are a young whippersnapper, such as yourself, or a seasoned veteran like… well, some on this blog!
Having said that, Jim is pretty old!
July 31st, 2008 at 11:22 pm
Travis, I couldn’t agree more… I mean, I wish I was old. There’s a lot of great things to be said for the twighlight years, even above and beyond the whole respect/wisdom bit. For one thing, those senior discounts and AARP benefits are nothing to sneaze at, especially with current economic conditions. Secondly, if I was old, I would have had the chance back in the day to see Black Sabbath perform live, just like my dear, sweet mom…
July 31st, 2008 at 11:23 pm
I will simply reiterate that “Twila is getting old, especially if ‘relatively long time’ is relative to the other active CCM recording artists.” In such a case the word is defined by objective data (ages of active CCM recording artists), not my subjective feelings (which happen to also be that she’s old).
July 31st, 2008 at 11:23 pm
Twila and I are the same age. Same month, same year.
I can’t speak for her (or Carole), but I’m what one would define as getting old.
Carole has forgotten her age, because she looks ten years younger than me.
July 31st, 2008 at 11:24 pm
dang, I mispelled “twilight”…
July 31st, 2008 at 11:26 pm
In all seriousness… I like the way you think, Travis! And I agree with you. 100%!
Now I have to go make sure Jim hasn’t wandered off AGAIN… the last time he did that, the neighbors complained that he was trying to convince them that he was Batman… It’s tough getting old…
July 31st, 2008 at 11:28 pm
Travis,
You know those grumpy old men who get tired of arguing, and just make a grumpy old man noise?
I just made one.
July 31st, 2008 at 11:29 pm
ex, when one reaches a certain age, one knows when there is a spell check feature.
July 31st, 2008 at 11:30 pm
exintern, don’t forget how the relatives let you get away with napping all through family gatherings! I’m still young enough that my aunts would just come along and whack me on the head with a rolled-up newspaper.
Jim, I think you’re in denial… but hey, that’s still better than being senile!
Carole, if he’s Batman, who does he try to convince them you are?
July 31st, 2008 at 11:31 pm
They all think I’m his VERY young, VERY attractive nurse’s aide.
July 31st, 2008 at 11:31 pm
You guys can argue all you want about whats old and young. We all know who the youngest on this forum is. *takes a bow*.
July 31st, 2008 at 11:34 pm
Hey little bro-show Ryan how to use spell check.
He’s at that awkward age.
July 31st, 2008 at 11:34 pm
Jim, that must be one of those “wisdom” advantages you have…’twas youthful indiscretion that did my post in… *hitting the (newly discovered) spell check buuton*
July 31st, 2008 at 11:34 pm
“We all know who the youngest on this forum is. *takes a bow*.”
Wait. Does that make me middle-aged?! Oh no… I feel a sudden urge to rush out and lease a Lamborghini!
July 31st, 2008 at 11:35 pm
Does that make CJ the joker?
July 31st, 2008 at 11:36 pm
haha yeah Ryan theres this little button with ABC and a check mark under it click that.
July 31st, 2008 at 11:39 pm
haha hey Josh there’s this little thing called an apostrophe…sometimes we use it in the English language.
July 31st, 2008 at 11:39 pm
I think it makes CJ Two Face doesn’t it?
July 31st, 2008 at 11:40 pm
young people don’t use grammar.
July 31st, 2008 at 11:40 pm
OK KIDS. Don’t make me stop this van!
July 31st, 2008 at 11:41 pm
Correction: young people don’t use grammar good.
July 31st, 2008 at 11:41 pm
But Dad, he started it!
July 31st, 2008 at 11:43 pm
DID NOOOOOOT!
…wait, “he” who?
July 31st, 2008 at 11:45 pm
Doesn’t matter, IT’S NOT MY FAULT SO YOU CAN’T GROUND ME!!
July 31st, 2008 at 11:46 pm
I think the reference was to me Travis, but not to worry.
August 1st, 2008 at 12:35 am
:::::::::::looks in & sees arguing brat boys & turns around and runs away::::::::
….quickly!
==:o
August 1st, 2008 at 1:35 am
Hey…why didn’t someone tell me there was a party going on here?
You guys are CRAZY!!
August 1st, 2008 at 4:08 am
Ahem… Ahem…..I find the juxtaposition of this party atmosphere at odds with the contents of the original post.
Can I now be classified as old now given my crotchidiness? (is that a word?)
August 1st, 2008 at 9:20 am
Go Anonymous! And welcome!
I have wonderful news. I just looked up Twila on Wikipedia and found that Jim is also older than I am! Whoo Hoo! This is a big birthday year for you, hey old fella?
August 1st, 2008 at 9:22 am
hahahaha!
Ellie… scaredy cat!… I can’t believe you left us to fend for ourselves!! You let a few young pups chase you away!
AKS… The whippersnappers ganged up on us!… they wait until it’s waaaayyyy past our bedtime and then attack… (sneaky boys…)
Anonymous… crotchidiness?… Naaaaahhhhh… you can only be classified as “old” if you can make the “grumpy old man” noise… THAT’S how you know you’ve arrived at “old”… (btw… I like your sense of humor!)
August 1st, 2008 at 9:28 am
Gracie,
I do this weird thing. I “round up”. When I was 43, I told people I was 45.
I’ve been telling people I’m 50 for a year and a half.
To me, birthdays don’t mean much. I had my big “crises” at 30-it’s been a breeze since then.
August 1st, 2008 at 9:31 am
Gracie… can you hear the “denial” in Jim’s response????? Acting all casual like…
August 1st, 2008 at 9:35 am
To which I’ll respond in that same way I responded to Travis last night:
“You know those grumpy old men who get tired of arguing, and just make a grumpy old man noise?
I just made one.
“
August 1st, 2008 at 9:36 am
Yep… I heard it…
August 1st, 2008 at 9:50 am
Oh yeah, Carole, I hear the denial. Jim, you “round up”, heh? So, you’ve sort of psyched yourself out? Interesting strategy.
Actually, to be honest, I do the same thing, but only to myself, never out loud! I’ll say, you know the big five-O is approaching. Get ready. It’s no big deal. It’s no big deal. It’s no big deal. (I repeat that one a lot). And I’m pretty sure I haven’t shown up at the neighbors trying to convince them I’m Batman. Hold on, I need to check with my husband. . . .
No. No Batman. And no drool or grunting yet either.
August 1st, 2008 at 9:57 am
Oh Carole, I have a few young pups here that I need relief from….sigh…a vacation would be nice…someday…
August 1st, 2008 at 10:03 am
Gracie,
I don’t recall the batman thing-but I don’t recall a lot of things.
The 70’s were hard on me
I’m just grateful that I can still find my way home after I venture out of my cave.
August 1st, 2008 at 10:18 am
My Papaw died when he was 39 - however, he had three kids and several grandkids who were also 39 when he ate his last meal, sighed with contentment, and went to be with his Savior in 2003.
Charles Garvice Douglas - (1905-2003) - teacher, musician, Lion, water commissioner, a prince among men, my hero.
August 1st, 2008 at 10:25 am
Acme,
It sounds like your Papaw was quite a man! What a wonderful tribute to him! (And wonderful memories of him… I’m sure you have lots more!)
August 1st, 2008 at 10:25 am
Wow acme.
What an excellent tribute to a man who lived a good, long life!
August 1st, 2008 at 10:27 am
Great minds think alike
August 7th, 2008 at 5:11 pm
Ryan-
Thanks for telling your story. As one who has endured SGM’s “public display of affection”, I know how much it can hurt to even talk about it.
Peace to you and Fallon
August 7th, 2008 at 7:24 pm
Thanks, musicman. What’s most difficult for me is learning just how many people are out there who, like you, can relate all too well to our story.
December 22nd, 2008 at 5:38 pm
Ryan, thank you so much for sharing your story. We knew each other a few years ago and I always wondered about the truth surrounding your situation. I am facing a similar situation with another SCG. It’s taken a while, but I’m finally starting to see the problems that you were talking about so long ago.
I’m glad to hear that you and Fallon are doing well!
December 22nd, 2008 at 6:22 pm
Future OUtcast,
stand strong in the Lord - the church (and SGM) may oust you, but He never will! You may experience some painful things in the future, including shunning and other unbiblical and unimaginable things, but like Ryan said, I think the Lord uses these things to “cure” us of our fear of man that we all have to varying degrees.
Some sound advice I’ve read over and over to those beginning to see problems and praying about things is to begin developing friendships outside of SGM so that when and if you are called to leave, the exodus doesn’t make you feel so isolated and alone - that of course is secondary to getting in the Word, building intimacy with Christ, and rediscovering your identity IN CHRIST, and realizing it was never in your church, or SGM. Blessings…Juli
December 23rd, 2008 at 9:49 am
Juli,
Your words are wise.
And I’m *still* learning to get my identity in Christ alone.
Still. I realize I’ve been drawing my identity from my grades. Imagine that. When who we are is in Christ, it cannot be changed or threatened. How amazing is that.
December 23rd, 2008 at 3:04 pm
Wow, I’m really sad to read this. Ryan wanting to share his story is really him just wanting to slander further. I’m shocked to see names. These issues should only be discussed between the individuals involved. Anything else is slander. Many facts have been conveniently left out of his letter. SGM is not the end all be all. I know this because I have been involved in other churches. I know that no church organization is perfect. Everyone makes mistakes and can handle situations differently. Don’t throw out the baby with the bath water! I really wish things were handled differently and that the slander would STOP! This is ancient history and if you still have a problem, then go to the source. There is no use harboring bitterness and stirring up dissension!